I’m definitely outraged! and what ARE we waiting for? Why is everyone waiting? WE NEED TO DO SOMETHING. THIS IS THE PEOPLE’S COUNTRY AND OUR RIGHTS. My first problem with this is that “government” isn’t meant to be efficient! It’s meant to be a LAST RESORT. I don’t mean that in a bad way, government isn’t meant to be good or bad or even wrong or right, but everything in the constitution is written in such a convoluted manner anyway…
What I don’t understand is how saving a failing establishment represents American ideology? IS THERE AN AMERICAN IDEOLOGY? Is it the pledge of allegiance or God Bless America? NO. No one cares about those songs. They just sing them rampantly thinking they’re being American by paying a lyrical homage to their soil. Well that’s fine, but personally, I still think this nation is too young to have developed any sense of direction. Yeah there’s pride… and the fact that we’re unstoppable at infiltrating any nation but it’s all filtered B***S***. The people that suffer through these rough times will come out stronger, smarter, and better prepared for the next disaster.
You know, when I was a kid, they stopped production on a toy I liked, cry me a river. I’d go to stores wondering why they didn’t sell them anymore as if someone was going to magically produce them just for me. Now, if I had just read the news a little more, maybe I could have found out why they’d stopped selling them, but my point is: If people don’t like what you’re selling enough to keep you in business, that means that there are other businesses providing the American people with what they need better than you are capable. Tough.
That is what capitalism is supposed to be about. You are free to venture off and do what you wish, make sure you pack a good chute.
Michael said,
in June 26th, 2009 at 11:12 pm
Under free enterprise, failing companies should indeed be left to fail, and better companies should survive. But we don’t live in a world of free enterprise.
“Competitive advantage” used to be sometimes dictated by random things like the climate in agriculture or natural ability. Unfortunately, in the modern world it is tied to policy more than we like to think. Foreign governments have policies to support their auto companies, including Japan who has supported Toyota for a long time.
You can demand free enterprise here in the name of “fair” competition, but you won’t get it. ever.
Even the best auto companies are struggling because of the larger economy. The best way to get this industry back on track will be for the economy to improve, not the other way around.
Khalid- The Constitution isn’t written in a convoluted manner, it’s just interpreted in a convoluted manner. Over the last six decades, we have accepted the notion of a “living constitution”…that each generation can extract any meaning they wish from the document. Why have a constitution at all, if every generation of corrupt politicians can manipulate the intent of the document to their petty needs?
There absolutely is an American ideology, and it has been systematically watered down in recent decades. Arguably, America is the only country ever to have a just sense of national direction. The American Ideology, as I see it, is one of personal liberty…not democracy. An ideology where the rights of one man are equal to the rights of a million; an ideology where each individual succeeds and fails on their merits; an ideology where the people control the government, rather than vice-versa.
Instead, we have a pro-active government that seeks to right the wrongs of society, the financial markets, and nearly every facet of our lives. With the best of intentions, we are dragging ourselves back hundreds of years…to be ruled by oligarchs rather than the law. As Thomas Jefferson once said, “I am not a friend to a very energetic government. It is always oppressive”.
Eric said,
in June 27th, 2009 at 12:22 pm
@mike: “You can demand free enterprise here in the name of “fair” competition, but you won’t get it. ever.”
Exactly why we aught to tear the entire rotting structure down. When I hear cynicism like this, it really reaffirms my hope that this economy will collapse under it’s own dead weight. Every couple generations has to suffer for the greater good. Maybe I wouldn’t be of this opinion if I had already experienced extreme hardship, but intuitively I know we’re heading in a dangerous direction.
Michael said,
in June 27th, 2009 at 3:22 pm
I forgot to add:
Ron Paul
Michael said,
in June 28th, 2009 at 3:28 am
“When I hear cynicism like this, it really reaffirms my hope that this economy will collapse under it’s own dead weight.”
I’m not being cynical about having free markets in the US. We could have them WITHIN int he US. Its a big part of our national identity. But while you might get free enterprise here in this country where you have a say, the competition still won’t be fair. you can’t stop other governments from tweaking their advantages.
“If people don’t like what you’re selling enough to keep you in business, that means that there are other businesses providing the American people with what they need better than you are capable. Tough.”
I’m not saying i’m in favor or against these bailouts. But its more than just making things people like or don’t like. Toyota got “bailed out” too, and the bank of japan can draw on fed dollar lines. Now it starts to look like more of a “buy Japan” campaign than a “let bad firms fail” issue. If you value market competition and thats your reason for being against the bailouts, you have to consider that the competition might have government support our firms can’t compete with alone. the “fair” playing ground of free enterprise is false because its not there, and letting our auto companies fail doesn’t make it appear
Anonymous said,
in June 28th, 2009 at 1:51 pm
I don’t even know anymore, maaaan
All hail the capitalist caliphate
Eric said,
in June 29th, 2009 at 1:55 pm
Maybe I’m naive, but I tend to think that the national economy with the least government interference would be the most capable of dealing with economic downturns.
Kabob said,
in June 29th, 2009 at 4:50 pm
It’s all so ambiguous, but in this specific instance, IMO, the government put us in this mess, and now they’re trying to help us get out of it. I just wonder what happened first, did people reach out to the government because a load of companies shot themselves in the foot? Or did the government reach out as a form of respect to the people when the people found out they might be out on their asses without a job.
Also, by helping the American people through these rough times, won’t America get some collective form of Stockholm syndrome instead of simply their just dues and a small consolation prize? Heck i’d take a bag of bubble gum and some Bennigan’s coupons, but not a lifetime of insecurity backed by a “government” who couldn’t get things right for the past 8 or so years possibly including Obama for those of you who believe in the “Obama Deception”.
I think everyone’s starting to get sick of how long these chapters have been in our lives.
Michael said,
in June 29th, 2009 at 5:55 pm
“Heck i’d take a bag of bubble gum and some Bennigan’s coupons”
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I’m definitely outraged! and what ARE we waiting for? Why is everyone waiting? WE NEED TO DO SOMETHING. THIS IS THE PEOPLE’S COUNTRY AND OUR RIGHTS. My first problem with this is that “government” isn’t meant to be efficient! It’s meant to be a LAST RESORT. I don’t mean that in a bad way, government isn’t meant to be good or bad or even wrong or right, but everything in the constitution is written in such a convoluted manner anyway…
What I don’t understand is how saving a failing establishment represents American ideology? IS THERE AN AMERICAN IDEOLOGY? Is it the pledge of allegiance or God Bless America? NO. No one cares about those songs. They just sing them rampantly thinking they’re being American by paying a lyrical homage to their soil. Well that’s fine, but personally, I still think this nation is too young to have developed any sense of direction. Yeah there’s pride… and the fact that we’re unstoppable at infiltrating any nation but it’s all filtered B***S***. The people that suffer through these rough times will come out stronger, smarter, and better prepared for the next disaster.
You know, when I was a kid, they stopped production on a toy I liked, cry me a river. I’d go to stores wondering why they didn’t sell them anymore as if someone was going to magically produce them just for me. Now, if I had just read the news a little more, maybe I could have found out why they’d stopped selling them, but my point is: If people don’t like what you’re selling enough to keep you in business, that means that there are other businesses providing the American people with what they need better than you are capable. Tough.
That is what capitalism is supposed to be about. You are free to venture off and do what you wish, make sure you pack a good chute.
Under free enterprise, failing companies should indeed be left to fail, and better companies should survive. But we don’t live in a world of free enterprise.
“Competitive advantage” used to be sometimes dictated by random things like the climate in agriculture or natural ability. Unfortunately, in the modern world it is tied to policy more than we like to think. Foreign governments have policies to support their auto companies, including Japan who has supported Toyota for a long time.
You can demand free enterprise here in the name of “fair” competition, but you won’t get it. ever.
Even the best auto companies are struggling because of the larger economy. The best way to get this industry back on track will be for the economy to improve, not the other way around.
http://ninecents.net/2009/03/04/president-addresses-congress/
Khalid- The Constitution isn’t written in a convoluted manner, it’s just interpreted in a convoluted manner. Over the last six decades, we have accepted the notion of a “living constitution”…that each generation can extract any meaning they wish from the document. Why have a constitution at all, if every generation of corrupt politicians can manipulate the intent of the document to their petty needs?
There absolutely is an American ideology, and it has been systematically watered down in recent decades. Arguably, America is the only country ever to have a just sense of national direction. The American Ideology, as I see it, is one of personal liberty…not democracy. An ideology where the rights of one man are equal to the rights of a million; an ideology where each individual succeeds and fails on their merits; an ideology where the people control the government, rather than vice-versa.
Instead, we have a pro-active government that seeks to right the wrongs of society, the financial markets, and nearly every facet of our lives. With the best of intentions, we are dragging ourselves back hundreds of years…to be ruled by oligarchs rather than the law. As Thomas Jefferson once said, “I am not a friend to a very energetic government. It is always oppressive”.
@mike: “You can demand free enterprise here in the name of “fair” competition, but you won’t get it. ever.”
Exactly why we aught to tear the entire rotting structure down. When I hear cynicism like this, it really reaffirms my hope that this economy will collapse under it’s own dead weight. Every couple generations has to suffer for the greater good. Maybe I wouldn’t be of this opinion if I had already experienced extreme hardship, but intuitively I know we’re heading in a dangerous direction.
I forgot to add:
Ron Paul
“When I hear cynicism like this, it really reaffirms my hope that this economy will collapse under it’s own dead weight.”
I’m not being cynical about having free markets in the US. We could have them WITHIN int he US. Its a big part of our national identity. But while you might get free enterprise here in this country where you have a say, the competition still won’t be fair. you can’t stop other governments from tweaking their advantages.
“If people don’t like what you’re selling enough to keep you in business, that means that there are other businesses providing the American people with what they need better than you are capable. Tough.”
I’m not saying i’m in favor or against these bailouts. But its more than just making things people like or don’t like. Toyota got “bailed out” too, and the bank of japan can draw on fed dollar lines. Now it starts to look like more of a “buy Japan” campaign than a “let bad firms fail” issue. If you value market competition and thats your reason for being against the bailouts, you have to consider that the competition might have government support our firms can’t compete with alone. the “fair” playing ground of free enterprise is false because its not there, and letting our auto companies fail doesn’t make it appear
I don’t even know anymore, maaaan
All hail the capitalist caliphate
Maybe I’m naive, but I tend to think that the national economy with the least government interference would be the most capable of dealing with economic downturns.
It’s all so ambiguous, but in this specific instance, IMO, the government put us in this mess, and now they’re trying to help us get out of it. I just wonder what happened first, did people reach out to the government because a load of companies shot themselves in the foot? Or did the government reach out as a form of respect to the people when the people found out they might be out on their asses without a job.
Also, by helping the American people through these rough times, won’t America get some collective form of Stockholm syndrome instead of simply their just dues and a small consolation prize? Heck i’d take a bag of bubble gum and some Bennigan’s coupons, but not a lifetime of insecurity backed by a “government” who couldn’t get things right for the past 8 or so years possibly including Obama for those of you who believe in the “Obama Deception”.
I think everyone’s starting to get sick of how long these chapters have been in our lives.
“Heck i’d take a bag of bubble gum and some Bennigan’s coupons”
Seconded
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pKFKGrmsBDk&feature=related
the video is about a year old, but there is a lot to it that applies to today.
WTF is going on here, are kabob and I totally switching roles?
You’re all a bunch of crackpots. Clearly, I am the only one who is sane.
Oh shi
hahah Tommy wins
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